Har-Bal Users Forum BBS

Vocals seem like the hardest thing for me to record and mix. Should I compress them while I am recording or after the vocalist leaves.

I also have problems sitting them directly in the song. Most of the time they sound like they are sitting on top.

Thkx

The best way to get good vocals is to first use the best gear u can obtain

I have recorded great vocals using a realistic radio shack mic
so its not nec. the most expensive gear that will yeald the best results
also for vocals its nice to have a good preamp and compressor
these are the most vital for gettin a good print
With skilled use of these 2 componants you should get a nice print that dose not clip ,, room issues is another link in the chain .. most ppl do not have access to a vocal booth and for those that do the same rules above applies...
when your vocal track is i recorded ... there are many ways to blend the vocals to sit in the mix the proper way... this of course is learned from time
and is an artform.
I use diff methods for achiveing this so for me there are many ways and it mainly begains with how the vocals was recorded .

Make good recordings
GET THE BEST SOUND GOIN IN TO THE SYSTEM
THIS WILL HELP U GET THE BEST SOUND COMING OUT

the simple answer is always "get the best gear you can"

I record vocals with a simple mic and a dbx226XL compressor. Not the greatest in the world, but it does the job well.

yes, you do generally need to compress while recording, but don't over compress, just compress enough to maintain some sort of control over the signal before going to the hard drive, tape or whatever. If you need more you can compress more later, but you can't remove overcompression...

I also have a lot of problems with vocals. I've messed around with them a lot but I am still no pro. It's definitaly true that you do get better over time as you try out different methods.

I find the biggest reason for vocals seeming to sit 'on top' of instrumentals rather than blending in is too much energy in the low and low-mid frequencies. I've looked at acapellas from pro recordings and I see that they have much less energy in the bassy regions. Also, almost every acapella I checked had a cut around 360hz.

Now, I tried Harbalizing vocals to loosely match the pro recordings but then my recording sounded thin. I checked to see if compression played a role and sure enough it did. My uncompressed vocals sounded much fuller when I matched them in Harbal to the pro acapellas than my compressed vocals did. Lesson #1: Don't overcompress!

That's as far as I've figured out on my own. Maybe someone else can explain how we can compress as we wish, cut out the bass in vocals, and still have a full sound.

Hope this helps

On most mixing consoles you can use the low cut 75 hz /18sb oct
this works well for that ,,
Compression is based on maintaining a certain level with out clipping.

I Say the best thing is Use your ears !
U can get the best gear and still not get the sound u are looking for
however yes Its kinda wise to stay away from cheap 17 dollar mics
But then again if that mic gives you a certain personality that sounds good enough for what you are looking for then go for it.
So I do agree... try to get the best you can aford. of your price range is say from 100 to 200 dont go for the cheapest just because its cheap.
DO NOT BE DECIVED BY INDUSTRY STANDARDS!!!

I was amazed at what a big difference it made when I created a makeshift vocal booth - a tent, really, with blankets and mic stands! The difference was striking - even at the same settings. The vocals sound much more focused, more articulate and clean. So I think the room must come into play quite a bit. The difference was more than subtle - and it's a cheap enhancement! I think the key is to deaden behind, to the sides and above the mic area. Behind the singer, I left it open.

I'm looking into a prortable setup - maybe some panels...

Larry

Tightrope wrote:I was amazed at what a big difference it made when I created a makeshift vocal booth - a tent, really, with blankets and mic stands! The difference was striking - even at the same settings. The vocals sound much more focused, more articulate and clean. So I think the room must come into play quite a bit. The difference was more than subtle - and it's a cheap enhancement! I think the key is to deaden behind, to the sides and above the mic area. Behind the singer, I left it open.

I'm looking into a prortable setup - maybe some panels...

Larry

Take a look at http://www.whisperroom.com/

Earle

I built some simple sound control boards for my room. They are along the lines of office cubicle walls, but quite a bit heavier duty. They work great for a variety of functions and are not too hard to build, and not too expensive.

I wrote a little article about how to build tham at my web site
http://www.homerecordingconnection.com/ ... tory&id=50 which might be worth a read for ya.

Hope it helps a little bit, cuz the pre-built rooms are really expensive.

Dan

I may actually try that. It is quite affordable and a worthy investment.

Earle

Yeah, give it a go. In my new house my studio is still concrete walls. These boards have made a huge difference in the sound. Plus, one side absorbs and the toher reflects, so you get both options, unlike cubicle-type walls...plus, they are movable all over the studio, or, like in my case, I have a couple on hooks and chains that just hang on the wall too.

Dan,

What sort of a difference did it make to the sound? Just curious really. I've just gotten to the stage of hanging the curtains in my room and initially wasn't too pleased with the outcome. Whilst it initially sound Ok it was fatiguing in the long run and when I did some measurements I found that some driver resonances where being exacerbated by the room. I then took my large rug out of the room and things sounded much better. Looks like I added too much damping and got into problems. It was also complicated by the fact that I've had a cold of sorts affecting my hearing so perhaps it wasn't as bad as I thought, but I certainly prefer it without the rug, or perhaps a smaller one just covering the front half of the room.

The other issue that I should probably tend to is side reflections directed straight back to my listening position. For the most part it isn't much of an issue cos my body blocks the path (sounds strange I know, but it has got to do with the fact that the room is pentagonal) but I'm still planning to make a pair of quadratic residual diffusers. Seems like more fun than buying them and a whole lot cheaper. Still, there's a lot of timber invovled in making a relatively small diffuser! If and when I've made them I can let you know how they went.

Cheers,


Paavo.

mainly what it did for me in my current room is help stop eflections coming back at me from behind off my rear walls. I have my desk angled in the middle of my room facing a back corner. The reflections were bouncing back at me from behind. I hung two of those absorbing side out with a bookcase between them in the corner, stacked full of books and it really killed that nasty reflections and changed the sound completely.

The other boards I have I just use where I need to, like to put between a couple of amps to isolate them more from each other, or to hang around a singers head or to put around a drum set. It really helps miking amps a lot.

Hello how is everyone Im back from being a bizzy body
I know I missed alot .... I hope everyone is well.
As you all know I have the deal with yamaha and some other deals with
others !

you know what would be cool if you could control harbal with a surface controler that would free you from the mouse even at the mastering stage