Best Plug-in order...

[zumbido]

By the way, did you get an RMS level of about -4.5 for that example?

[har-bal]

By the way, did you get an RMS level of about -4.5 for that example?

Yes, I sure did.

-7.94 Left Channel
-8.19 Right Channel

Should be against the law

Earle

[dke]

I'm confused here. I decided to load up a couple of songs to check this out and
for STP's Sextype Thing one which you would expect to be pretty squashed has
har bal:
-1.98dB Average in HB
8.54dB Peak

Same file in Audition:

Minimum RMS Power: -69.14 dB -70.08 dB
Maximum RMS Power: -7.12 dB -7.9 dB
Average RMS Power: -9.36 dB -10.14 dB
Total RMS Power: -9.28 dB -10.06 dB

A second file an old Boston tune Smokin'
har bal:
-3.57dB Average
10.57dB Peak

Audition:
Left Right
Minimum RMS Power: -91.72 dB -71.01 dB
Maximum RMS Power: -9.11 dB -9.58 dB
Average RMS Power: -13.43 dB -13.95 dB
Total RMS Power: -13.14 dB -13.66 dB

Shouldn't Har Bal and Audition's numbers be about the same? Do I have something set wrong?

Dan

[har-bal]

I'm confused here. I decided to load up a couple of songs to check this out and
for STP's Sextype Thing one which you would expect to be pretty squashed has
har bal:
-1.98dB Average in HB
8.54dB Peak

Same file in Audition:

Minimum RMS Power: -69.14 dB -70.08 dB
Maximum RMS Power: -7.12 dB -7.9 dB
Average RMS Power: -9.36 dB -10.14 dB
Total RMS Power: -9.28 dB -10.06 dB

A second file an old Boston tune Smokin'
har bal:
-3.57dB Average
10.57dB Peak

Audition:
Left Right
Minimum RMS Power: -91.72 dB -71.01 dB
Maximum RMS Power: -9.11 dB -9.58 dB
Average RMS Power: -13.43 dB -13.95 dB
Total RMS Power: -13.14 dB -13.66 dB

Shouldn't Har Bal and Audition's numbers be about the same? Do I have something set wrong?

Dan

Dan

They are actual dB levels in Har-Bal but not in the sense you are used to. Your more acustomed to the level as portrayed by VU meters but in the spectral domain how strong something appears is a function of its bandwidth and its level. For example, if you take a sine wave and pink noise both of the same power, the levels as displayed by a VU meter will be the same for both signals but in the frequency domain the sine wave will have a large peak that is at a much higher level than the spectrum line representing the pink noise. This is because the power of the signal in the frequency domain is the integral sum of the components across the spectrum. That is the area under the curve (when displayed on linear-linear scale) is the same for the sine wave spectrum and the pink noise spectrum.

If you're lost think of it in this way. You have a balloon of fixed volume and it has a particular overall length. Now squeeze the balloon and what happens to the length? It increases because the volume in the balloon is trying to stay constant and your restricting its width. A similar thing happens with signals in the frequency domain but in this case the width is the "spectral width". A sine has a very small spectral width so the peak level in the spectrum is correspondingly much higher than for a wide bandwidth signal like pink noise. For this reason it isn't very useful to think about the absolute values on the spectrum axis too much cos it is only the area under the curve that has an easily identifiable physical significance. By the way, the reference I used for the dB scale was arbitrarily chosen. In the next release it will be dB referred to a full scale sine wave, which you may or may not find more useful.

Regards,

Paavo.

[dke]

Ah okay, I was just misunderstanding the values har bal shows vs Audition.

Dan

[jammer]

I'd say this record looks more like a 4 x 12.

And what's great, with Har-Bal and T-RackS, I (or anyone) can acheive this 'effect'.

And it never goes over '0' on playback!

There is a major problem making a song this loud. It would be robbed of its dynamic range.

-4.5 average rms is the actual destruction of a song.

Why would anyone want their track this loud?

Earle

well that is what is happening in general out there in mastering land ...

http://www.jammer.biz/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=24