Har-Bal Users Forum BBS

Hello,
As part of the search for the ultimate drum sound I am forever 'fiddling with the alignment of all of the drum tracks in any given song. I have read various methods like using the transient peak to line up etc but I find that even if I can can find a really clean hit say on the snare that was picked up rather well by all mics in use at the time and if I line up the tracks from that point, it will be out a few hits later down the track, some but not all and some by quite a bit. I have never managed to successfully line up a track that is consistent from start to finish. Is this normal or am I doing it all wrong? I can hear an audible difference as I bring them all closer together ie tighter image etc but how close is close enough? (Hope this makes sence.) My natural assumption would have been, line up the first hit or two and the rest should fall into place naturally as the distance from the mics never change.
Thanks for your time,

Nigel.

How much out is "quite a bit". I can imagine that the time differences could change depending on how consistent the drummer is with his hits and where on the skin he hits it, though I wouldn't have imagined it to change by that much.

How close is close enough is debatable. You are basically trying to set it up so that you can change your mix freely without loosing clarity in a particular drum or cymbal. If you find something getting smeared as you change the mix then you could say it probably isn't close enough, but with multi-mic'ing it is almost impossible to guarantee that you'll be ableto optimise all channels. You may have to compromise one over the other to get the best sound. On typical tracks that would probably mean optimising the snare and the hi-hat as they're generally feature most prominently.

If you can't get the quality you want you might consider reducing the number of mics by one or more to reduce the number of spill issues to deal with. Quite often the adage "less is more" holds true.

cheers,


Paavo.

Paavo,
I think in terms of actual time its is very small indeed, When inlarged on screen to its fullest in cubase, some hits line up at the start across multiple tracks, others about halfway into the close mic hit (say between snare and OH) others sometimes after the first impact of the stick has passed (But this is rare). The drummer in question at the moment is very inconsistant with dynamic and I think that may be the answer I am looking for. Even though I multi mic I always remove unwanted noise between hits on all drums tracks (close mics) so never have more than 4 - 8 mics 'live' at any one time.
Thanks once again Paavo, I think in all the time I have been trying to learn the art of recording you are the first proffesional that has ever bothered to give me the time of day letalone pass on so much wisdom so freely. For that I will always be in your debt, you really have no idea how much it means to me and how much you have taught me.

Thank you my friend,

Nigel.

Thanks Nigel. It's a pleasure, at least when someone is actually trying to understand as you are. Not so much fun if someone is just looking for an instant fix and doesn't want to be bothered learning anything. Whatever the case, we all learn off each other, and the more you have to explain something the better your understanding of it. Quite often you realise the mistakes in your own thinking when trying to explain something so, it helps me as much as it helps you.

Cheers,


Paavo.