HI, i was wondering if any of you guys know if i can use the pspvintage meter plug-in as a actual V-U meter to find the SPL of my audio before i start to mix?......i use headphones...(i know i know its not wise to use headphones to mix)......But were i live i cant crack up the volume so i gotta stick to wat i can do rather than what i Cant do.
is there any way of doin this?
SPL Level
You need to know the sensitivity of the headphones and you need to keep the chain gain from where the VU meter measures to the headphone input fixed (ie. no volume control in between). You might be able to find headphone sensitivity figures from the manufacturer specs but more often than not they don't tell you that.
By the way, I don't have any problems you with mixing through headphones. In fact, for the average home studio person I'd recommend it because more often than not their room acoustics will be far from optimal. In particular, I'd recommend you do the overall level and EQ adjustments using headphones to obtain the desired tonality and then use you monitors to determine panning settings. That way your are less likely to have your adjustments biased by bad acoustics although this does assume that your headphones are reasonably good. Feel free to ignore this advice if your setup is A1 but unless you've got diffusers on the primary reflection points or unless you've got a very large room it probably isn't.
The only other thing I'd mention about headphones is be careful not to overdrive your ears. It is hard to judge absolute loudness with headphones. As a consequence, many people who use them a lot, including the masses of people with iPods and the like, end up damaging their hearing through over exposure to loud sounds.
Cheers,
Paavo.
By the way, I don't have any problems you with mixing through headphones. In fact, for the average home studio person I'd recommend it because more often than not their room acoustics will be far from optimal. In particular, I'd recommend you do the overall level and EQ adjustments using headphones to obtain the desired tonality and then use you monitors to determine panning settings. That way your are less likely to have your adjustments biased by bad acoustics although this does assume that your headphones are reasonably good. Feel free to ignore this advice if your setup is A1 but unless you've got diffusers on the primary reflection points or unless you've got a very large room it probably isn't.
The only other thing I'd mention about headphones is be careful not to overdrive your ears. It is hard to judge absolute loudness with headphones. As a consequence, many people who use them a lot, including the masses of people with iPods and the like, end up damaging their hearing through over exposure to loud sounds.
Cheers,
Paavo.
Hi ,
If you would prefer RMS measurements , as opposed to VU , there's a free plug called RMS Buddy , which works well ( just place in the chain , play once , and read off ) .
Do insert it POST fade ...
Cheerz ..
If you would prefer RMS measurements , as opposed to VU , there's a free plug called RMS Buddy , which works well ( just place in the chain , play once , and read off ) .
Do insert it POST fade ...
Cheerz ..
" I hate compression with a vengeance . I avoid it . I'm a great believer in the dynamic range being preserved " Alan Parsons
I mix at different Volume Levels. Soft, Med & farly Loud. Stereo & Mono. I Mix Using 3 Different Speaker Set ups. Hi-End Studio Monitors, Average Home Speakers & cheap Car Speakers.
I Mix on my Studio Monitors first. At various Volume levels, Stereo & Mono. Repeat this process on Home Spkrs, finally Cheapie Spkrs. Stereo & Mono. When the Mix sounds good on all 3 individually I usually have a good Mix that translates well in most environments.
I do have a Room that is Acoustically treated that has been tuned by an RTA.
Finally I give it the Heaphone test. If it sounds good on each listening environment I usually have a pretty good Mix.
That is, until I download to Har Bal & can actually see the Peaks & Valleys. I'm going through that learning curve right now. It seems like a great tool for final stages of Mastering.
Point is; Loud Mixing on Monitors, in itself, is not anymore accurate than Mixing on heaphones. Various environments are necessary as well as various Volumes in Stereo & Mono Modes.
Be cautious with your EARS. Tinnitus is caused by many things, Loud Volume listening on Headphones is one them. It is incurable! Ask Pete Townshend of the "WHO". He has a Website devoted to this.
Hope there is something here you can use.
Lucky
I Mix on my Studio Monitors first. At various Volume levels, Stereo & Mono. Repeat this process on Home Spkrs, finally Cheapie Spkrs. Stereo & Mono. When the Mix sounds good on all 3 individually I usually have a good Mix that translates well in most environments.
I do have a Room that is Acoustically treated that has been tuned by an RTA.
Finally I give it the Heaphone test. If it sounds good on each listening environment I usually have a pretty good Mix.
That is, until I download to Har Bal & can actually see the Peaks & Valleys. I'm going through that learning curve right now. It seems like a great tool for final stages of Mastering.
Point is; Loud Mixing on Monitors, in itself, is not anymore accurate than Mixing on heaphones. Various environments are necessary as well as various Volumes in Stereo & Mono Modes.
Be cautious with your EARS. Tinnitus is caused by many things, Loud Volume listening on Headphones is one them. It is incurable! Ask Pete Townshend of the "WHO". He has a Website devoted to this.
Hope there is something here you can use.
Lucky
-
Gordon Gidluck
- Posts: 40
- Joined: Sat Dec 04, 2004 7:18 pm
- Location: Arkansas
- Contact:
When making decisions about equalization, it is important to listen at a calibrated level. For me on loudspeakers I usually shoot for about 85 decibels. (A loudness meter is a must to keep around for setting or rechecking your listening level.)
The reason for the calibrated level is because we humans hear different frequencies better at different sound pressure levels. Here is an interesting reference on the subject.
http://www.moultonlabs.com/more/equal_l ... ntours/P0/
Now how does this translate to headphones? (And I do a lot of my listening on headphones too). I don't know how it would be possible calibrate them for SPL, but I just try to make the level about the same as what I would be listening to on loudspeakers. It's a guess of course.
I suppose that some enterprising company should make a little transducer that can fit inside the headphone and plug into a loudness meter. That would be a good product!
The reason for the calibrated level is because we humans hear different frequencies better at different sound pressure levels. Here is an interesting reference on the subject.
http://www.moultonlabs.com/more/equal_l ... ntours/P0/
Now how does this translate to headphones? (And I do a lot of my listening on headphones too). I don't know how it would be possible calibrate them for SPL, but I just try to make the level about the same as what I would be listening to on loudspeakers. It's a guess of course.
I suppose that some enterprising company should make a little transducer that can fit inside the headphone and plug into a loudness meter. That would be a good product!
What about it Har-Bal? Something to make heaphones accurate for Mixing?Gordon Gidluck wrote:When making decisions about equalization, it is important to listen at a calibrated level. For me on loudspeakers I usually shoot for about 85 decibels. (A loudness meter is a must to keep around for setting or rechecking your listening level.)
The reason for the calibrated level is because we humans hear different frequencies better at different sound pressure levels. Here is an interesting reference on the subject.
http://www.moultonlabs.com/more/equal_l ... ntours/P0/
Now how does this translate to headphones? (And I do a lot of my listening on headphones too). I don't know how it would be possible calibrate them for SPL, but I just try to make the level about the same as what I would be listening to on loudspeakers. It's a guess of course.
I suppose that some enterprising company should make a little transducer that can fit inside the headphone and plug into a loudness meter. That would be a good product!
Lucky
Luckylucky wrote:I mix at different Volume Levels. Soft, Med & farly Loud. Stereo & Mono. I Mix Using 3 Different Speaker Set ups. Hi-End Studio Monitors, Average Home Speakers & cheap Car Speakers.
I Mix on my Studio Monitors first. At various Volume levels, Stereo & Mono. Repeat this process on Home Spkrs, finally Cheapie Spkrs. Stereo & Mono. When the Mix sounds good on all 3 individually I usually have a good Mix that translates well in most environments.
I do have a Room that is Acoustically treated that has been tuned by an RTA.
Finally I give it the Heaphone test. If it sounds good on each listening environment I usually have a pretty good Mix.
That is, until I download to Har Bal & can actually see the Peaks & Valleys. I'm going through that learning curve right now. It seems like a great tool for final stages of Mastering.
Point is; Loud Mixing on Monitors, in itself, is not anymore accurate than Mixing on heaphones. Various environments are necessary as well as various Volumes in Stereo & Mono Modes.
Be cautious with your EARS. Tinnitus is caused by many things, Loud Volume listening on Headphones is one them. It is incurable! Ask Pete Townshend of the "WHO". He has a Website devoted to this.
Hope there is something here you can use.
Lucky
Gordon is correct. The ideal volume level when mixing or mastering IS 85dBs. It is at this level you are able to hear all instruments evenly across the spectrum without suffering from the "louder sounds better" disease.
When you have a spectrum that is balanced (no major peaks or dips) there is no reason to test it on a variety of systems. The track will be transportable in any system.
Har-Bal gives you the extra edge where previously only your ears were at your disposal. There is nothing wrong with using your ears mind you, as long as you are in a room that is acoustically correct.
The idea is to allow your ears to work in concert with your eyes.
Feed a few well mastered songs into Har-Bal and look at the overall spectrum. Do well mastered CD's all have something in common?
You be the judge.
Cheers
Earle
This is new territory for me but I'm very excited to try your product on our CD's. Our CD's sound pretty darn good now but need something to make it more equal to the Bigs.
It's hard for me to comprehend how Har-Bal can adjust the Mix?
How hard should I work on my Mix in the Studio before Har-Balizing? I spend alot of time dialing them in. Will I save time Mixing?
Do better Mixes equate better on Har-Bal or does it make any difference? Can I just input any old schlock Mix and make it sound great?
Does Har-Ball have a way to adjust levels to 85 Dbs.?
I'll be placing my order tomorrow for 2.2.
Thanks a heap,
Lucky
It's hard for me to comprehend how Har-Bal can adjust the Mix?
How hard should I work on my Mix in the Studio before Har-Balizing? I spend alot of time dialing them in. Will I save time Mixing?
Do better Mixes equate better on Har-Bal or does it make any difference? Can I just input any old schlock Mix and make it sound great?
Does Har-Ball have a way to adjust levels to 85 Dbs.?
I'll be placing my order tomorrow for 2.2.
Thanks a heap,
Lucky
Lucky ,
Har-Bal adjusts the mix through eq changes ..... it's a very precise , powerful , and fancy eq system ... at heart ...
It is not the whole story on 'commercial level' sound ... go read Earle's mastering tutorial for other steps , often used in the mastering chain ...
You work as hard as ever on your mixes .... the mastering may bring out any deficiencies in it ... esp. low level detail , which will be disproportionately raised in the process .... The ideal mix to bring to Har-Bal is one which needs no adjustment to it ... something which use of Har-Bal will educate you in ....
Like many systems GI,GO .... and if there's a serious hole in a spectrum , boosting there may well be boosting thin , nasty-sounding , air ....
Think of it like applying a gloss coat if painting ... the quality of your preparation will dictate the outcome of the final result ... and a nice top-coat will really set a good job off ...
The 85dB mentioned is Sound Pressure Level , at your ear , in your room ... it largely depends on amps/speakers and room ... not on fine tweaks to eq ... It's suggested to work at that volume to have the most 'flat' hearing .....
Cheerz ....
Har-Bal adjusts the mix through eq changes ..... it's a very precise , powerful , and fancy eq system ... at heart ...
It is not the whole story on 'commercial level' sound ... go read Earle's mastering tutorial for other steps , often used in the mastering chain ...
You work as hard as ever on your mixes .... the mastering may bring out any deficiencies in it ... esp. low level detail , which will be disproportionately raised in the process .... The ideal mix to bring to Har-Bal is one which needs no adjustment to it ... something which use of Har-Bal will educate you in ....
Like many systems GI,GO .... and if there's a serious hole in a spectrum , boosting there may well be boosting thin , nasty-sounding , air ....
Think of it like applying a gloss coat if painting ... the quality of your preparation will dictate the outcome of the final result ... and a nice top-coat will really set a good job off ...
The 85dB mentioned is Sound Pressure Level , at your ear , in your room ... it largely depends on amps/speakers and room ... not on fine tweaks to eq ... It's suggested to work at that volume to have the most 'flat' hearing .....
Cheerz ....
" I hate compression with a vengeance . I avoid it . I'm a great believer in the dynamic range being preserved " Alan Parsons
Lucky ,
Is an much as Har-Bal can , in limited fashion , adjust your electronic gain ... it can have some effect . However , the sound pressure in your room is largely determined by amp power/settings etc ...
Get a sound meter , position at your ear level when monitoring .. and set your amps accordingly .
As Har-Bal has very clever , and handy , volume compensation built in ; once levels are set , your SPLs won't alter with Har-Bal's filter on , or off ....
Cheerz ...
Is an much as Har-Bal can , in limited fashion , adjust your electronic gain ... it can have some effect . However , the sound pressure in your room is largely determined by amp power/settings etc ...
Get a sound meter , position at your ear level when monitoring .. and set your amps accordingly .
As Har-Bal has very clever , and handy , volume compensation built in ; once levels are set , your SPLs won't alter with Har-Bal's filter on , or off ....
Cheerz ...
" I hate compression with a vengeance . I avoid it . I'm a great believer in the dynamic range being preserved " Alan Parsons
-
Gordon Gidluck
- Posts: 40
- Joined: Sat Dec 04, 2004 7:18 pm
- Location: Arkansas
- Contact:
I was speaking about how to set the loudness of your playback system so that you can make the best decision regarding equaliization.lucky wrote:Does Har-Bal have the ability to help me adjust my sound levels to 85Decibles as recommended in previous responses to this thread? Do I need a Sound Meter? How does it work?
Thanks, Lucky
When listening to the track this is just an adjustment of your volume control.
Once that level is set, use Harbal to adjust your eq.
I don't use Harbal so much to adjust the level up and down. Only the equalization. I use Samplitude for other stuff like amplitude, compression and limiting if needed.
Gordon
I purchased Har-Bal 2.2 today and am reading instructions.
I also purchased a sound level meter. I am Mixing a Song in the Studio that I want to Har-Balize. I set the Sound meter on a tri-pod where my ears would normally be in Mixing position & adjusted Volume til meter read +/- 85 Db.
Should the Volume be that Loud? It's seems extremely loud & ears fatigue quickly. Is this normal?
Lucky
I also purchased a sound level meter. I am Mixing a Song in the Studio that I want to Har-Balize. I set the Sound meter on a tri-pod where my ears would normally be in Mixing position & adjusted Volume til meter read +/- 85 Db.
Should the Volume be that Loud? It's seems extremely loud & ears fatigue quickly. Is this normal?
Lucky
Hi Lucky ,
Yes .. it's relatively loud ... but is the volume at which your ears give the truest representation of what's coming from your speakers ...
It is recommended that 8 hours straight at that volume may lead to ear damage ... in terms of safety ... but do take breaks ...
Measure with 'A-weighting' if possible .....
If you do monitor at lesser levels , be aware you may overemphasise both top , and bottom end of your spectrum ... which may be an effect you enjoy ...
Cheerz ...
Yes .. it's relatively loud ... but is the volume at which your ears give the truest representation of what's coming from your speakers ...
It is recommended that 8 hours straight at that volume may lead to ear damage ... in terms of safety ... but do take breaks ...
Measure with 'A-weighting' if possible .....
If you do monitor at lesser levels , be aware you may overemphasise both top , and bottom end of your spectrum ... which may be an effect you enjoy ...
Cheerz ...
" I hate compression with a vengeance . I avoid it . I'm a great believer in the dynamic range being preserved " Alan Parsons
Hi Lucky,
Yes, 85 dB SPL is pretty loud and I don't do much listening at that level (probable more like 75-80dB but I've never measured it). You don't need to do your EQ'ing at that level and I wouldn't recommend it for the sake of perserving your ears but you should periodically check your work at that level to make sure it holds up.
By the way, be sure to use a pink noise source when calibrating for 85dB and not a sine wave. An 85dB SPL sine wave is much louder than 85dB SPL pink noise as likely to damage your hearing and possibly your speakers.
Cheers,
Paavo.
Yes, 85 dB SPL is pretty loud and I don't do much listening at that level (probable more like 75-80dB but I've never measured it). You don't need to do your EQ'ing at that level and I wouldn't recommend it for the sake of perserving your ears but you should periodically check your work at that level to make sure it holds up.
By the way, be sure to use a pink noise source when calibrating for 85dB and not a sine wave. An 85dB SPL sine wave is much louder than 85dB SPL pink noise as likely to damage your hearing and possibly your speakers.
Cheers,
Paavo.