Har-Bal Users Forum BBS

Can you explain how I can tell the beginning & end of a Song by looking at the Sound Spectrum Screen?

Thanks,

Lucky

lucky wrote:Can you explain how I can tell the beginning & end of a Song by looking at the Sound Spectrum Screen?

Thanks,

Lucky

Please clarify your question.

When you observe the spectrum in Har-Bal you are looking at a snapshot of the entire audio spectrum of the song. The spectrum simply allows you to see the overall spectral view from 20Hz - 20kHz

Spectral analysis measures or calculates the amount of acoustic energy present at different frequencies in a sound.

Har-Bal doesn't see it as a song, it see it as a sound

You are not looking at the beginning and end of the song.

Earle

In your Tutorial on each of the Song examples it says something like,"Looking at the Spectrum we see that it extends from around 50Hz to 10kHz with a subdued mid-range & a prominence at 5kHz. We start by selecting the IntuitQ cursor & then applying it to the frequency range from 59Hz to 9.7kHz as illistrated. {example; Thunder & Lightning}.

I look at the Spectrum & it looks like the Song begins at about 30Hz & fades out on the far right past 10kHz. I know I'm wrong.

I'd like to know specifically what it is you are looking at that tells you where the Song Begins & ends, & why? Forgive the newbie!

Thank you,

Lucky

PS When I purchased my Har-Bal I requested the CD copy of the Software as I have multiple Computers. I haven't received it. Could someone check into it & have it sent to me. Thx!

lucky wrote:In your Tutorial on each of the Song examples it says something like,"Looking at the Spectrum we see that it extends from around 50Hz to 10kHz with a subdued mid-range & a prominence at 5kHz. We start by selecting the IntuitQ cursor & then applying it to the frequency range from 59Hz to 9.7kHz as illistrated. {example; Thunder & Lightning}.

I look at the Spectrum & it looks like the Song begins at about 30Hz & fades out on the far right past 10kHz. I know I'm wrong.

I'd like to know specifically what it is you are looking at that tells you where the Song Begins & ends, & why? Forgive the newbie!

Thank you,

Lucky

PS When I purchased my Har-Bal I requested the CD copy of the Software as I have multiple Computers. I haven't received it. Could someone check into it & have it sent to me. Thx!

You need to send an email to our support and we will forward it to RegNet for you concerning your CD copy.

As far as understanding spectrum analysis there is some fundamental information necessary for you to know before you can go further. We understand your newness to the audio world, but it is imperative that you do some homework before delving too deep. Otherwise you are going to move forward without a complete understanding. It may be necessary for you to start reading up on Spectrum Analyzers and their function. How do they relate to the audio world and what is it they are telling you and what you should be looking for.
Har-Bal is an advanced tool and the only way to derive real benefit from it or similar tools is to burn the midnight oil studying.
The more you understand the more it will really start to make sense. Trust us on this!!

It is truly a labor of love.

Cheers

Earle

I agree with Earle regarding the need to familiarise yourself to the interpretation of spectrums and spectrum analyzers.

On your orignal question, the range you should typically apply intuitQ to is what I refer to as the dominant range. To understand what I mean by that try looking at the spectrum plot as a cross section through a mountain. These "audio" mountains typically have a fairly flatish top or plateau and at either end it falls off steeply. The dominant range is the plateau part.

You can pretty much learn how to interpret this by using the big intuitQ button. Press it on any given track and then take a look at the frequency response view. You can see the dominant range it chose by noting the that outside the its chosen dominant range there is very little gain adjustment in the frequency response. Now try and see how these points in frequency relate to the spectrum shape. Do this on a large number of tracks of different styles and you should start building a mental piucture.

Regards,


Paavo.

Thanks for the clarification.

Is there a good reference re; Spectrum Analyzers that you could recommend?

Thanks,

Lucky

[quote="lucky"]Thanks for the clarification.

Is there a good reference re; Spectrum Analyzers that you could recommend?

Thanks,

Lucky[/quote

I've been doing alot of reading on Spectrum Analysis & have a better understanding. I don't see how it relates to my question though.

I haven't found anything in my reading that claifies how to determine beginnings & endings of a Song on the Spectrum. Please explain.

Thank you,

Lucky

I think you may be confusing the har-bal display with that of an audio editor.

In an audio editor the X-axis (horizontal) is time and the Y-axis (vertical) shows you amplitude.

In har-bal the X-axis is frequency and the Y-axis is in decibels. So there is no time dimension in the graph.

So, you can't see the beginning or ending of a song in har-bal. It's a graph of how much audio is present in the entire track in each frequency range.

Think of har-bal more as an equalizer. It's like an equalizer with 8192 individual bands!

lucky wrote:In your Tutorial on each of the Song examples it says something like,"Looking at the Spectrum we see that it extends from around 50Hz to 10kHz with a subdued mid-range & a prominence at 5kHz. We start by selecting the IntuitQ cursor & then applying it to the frequency range from 59Hz to 9.7kHz as illistrated. {example; Thunder & Lightning}.

I look at the Spectrum & it looks like the Song begins at about 30Hz & fades out on the far right past 10kHz. I know I'm wrong.

I'd like to know specifically what it is you are looking at that tells you where the Song Begins & ends, & why? Forgive the newbie!

Thank you,

Lucky

PS When I purchased my Har-Bal I requested the CD copy of the Software as I have multiple Computers. I haven't received it. Could someone check into it & have it sent to me. Thx!

Gordon,

The Tutorial speaks of Start & End points on Songs & adding IntuitQ between those points. I am trying understand how one determines those points viewing the Spectrum Graph.

Thanks,

Lucky

After reading the example I think I get what you are asking now.

The start and end points are frequency ranges.

I think that they are recommending that you select start and end points for IntuitQ only at points where the audio is dominant.

IntuitQ used to do it's calculations based upon more of the entire frequency range in an older version. I think the idea there with the newer version is to narrow the focus to an area which contains the dominant frequencies.

[quote="Gordon Gidluck"]After reading the example I think I get what you are asking now.

The start and end points are frequency ranges.

I think that they are recommending that you select start and end points for IntuitQ only at points where the audio is dominant.

IntuitQ used to do it's calculations based upon more of the entire frequency range in an older version. I think the idea there with the newer version is to narrow the focus to an area which contains the dominant frequencies.[/quote

I'm correct in assuming beginning and end points are basically arbitrary?

I know that different insert points yield different results. That is why I'm curious. I just want to achieve the best results possible.

Thanks,

Lucky

Yes, it's arbitrary. So you could exclude a part of the graph if you believe that it's ok as is. The 2.2 version allows you to treat certain areas with IntuitQ where you think there are problems.

lucky wrote:I'm correct in assuming beginning and end points are basically arbitrary?

I know that different insert points yield different results. That is why I'm curious. I just want to achieve the best results possible.

Exactly! The results you get depend quite a bit on the choice of end point and there is no way to accurately generalise the problem. It all depends on the track in hand. You basically need to experiment using different end-points and listening to the corresponding results and then select the one that sounds best to you. That is the only way of optimising the end result.

IntuitQ applied to the whole track is an optimal filter on the basis of masking but as pointed out in the tutorial, there is good masking and bad masking. The only way to tell which is which is through applying intuitQ (and intuitNull) using a variety of approaches and chosing which sounds the best. You are central to the process!

Regards,


Paavo.